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 Post subject: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2009 9:16 pm 
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hi new to this forum but owned a few zooks all have been 1.3. i have finally got myself a 1.6 16v engine and want to no what the most commom mods people do to them and where to buy parts for them. looked a fair bit around on the net but all parts for sale have been for the 1.3 any help or steering me in the right direction would be great.


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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 2:38 am 
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bails wrote:
hi new to this forum but owned a few zooks all have been 1.3. i have finally got myself a 1.6 16v engine and want to no what the most commom mods people do to them and where to buy parts for them. looked a fair bit around on the net but all parts for sale have been for the 1.3 any help or steering me in the right direction would be great.


i have access for vitara 1.6 engine.. single cam.. my cultus gti used vitara bottom end for better torque. Some swifter used stock 1.3 block but using 1.6 head :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 5:43 pm 
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I have put a twincam gti head on my missus 1.6 baleno block. It gets you more hp than any other mod. Unless you turbo it.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:18 pm 
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1600GTI wrote:
I have put a twincam gti head on my missus 1.6 baleno block. It gets you more hp than any other mod. Unless you turbo it.


agree with you mate !

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:32 pm 
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Is it the twin cam head that makes the increase, or the aftermarket engine management required to run it on the 1600 block? I don't see how an extra cam would make much improvement on its own, considering both heads are 16v and the SOHC has larger valves to start with.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:38 pm 
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[YLD80Y] wrote:
Is it the twin cam head that makes the increase, or the aftermarket engine management required to run it on the 1600 block? I don't see how an extra cam would make much improvement on its own, considering both heads are 16v and the SOHC has larger valves to start with.


the vitara block will make the increase.. just plug in to gti head and need to modified the block to fix the gearbox

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 7:55 pm 
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That doesn't answer my question. If the G16B has a 16 valve head, how does fitting a head with an extra cam increase the power output?

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 8:23 pm 
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[YLD80Y] wrote:
That doesn't answer my question. If the G16B has a 16 valve head, how does fitting a head with an extra cam increase the power output?


i dont know how to describe it technically and im not good in that. but from my experience, the respon is much2 better from the stock g13b block..

maybe someone can advice??

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 8:51 pm 
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good point yldboy

i think the only real gain in this combo is the flowrate and airspeed of the g13b head
with an extra cam the air can move faster with less resistance
for considerable power gains in na, alot of homework has to go into things like bore size,stroke
compression cams and head flow to get it to work efficiently and reliably

nascar is a good example of this

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 9:02 pm 
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A SOHC 16 valve engine would have better torque on the low end where the DOHC valvetrain’s weight results in lower torque. But at high engine speeds, the 16 valve DOHC engine’s peak torque and horsepower would be greater. I have tested this down the quarter mile. Before I put the twincam conversion the SOHC is quicker off the line but after 100m the DOHC eats it up with the torque and HP climbing in higher revs. Other wise a if a 1.6 SOHC was a better setup then the baleno should smash a 1.3 twincam GTI.................but it doesnt. All up the the conversion has taken 1.5 seconds off my 1/4 mile.
And I am now rebuilding the g16a/twincam. It has 11.5-1 compression bigger cams(cant remember specs but its bigger than the bd14 cams) stronger valve springs bigger valves etc.
plus $2500 worth of porting and cleaning up the head.
expecting mid-high 13s. There is no way I could extract that power from a SOHC.
And i dont want to hear. Awww you should have turboed it. N/A all the way. Plus its my missus car and i require her alive for a while longer.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:16 pm 
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G16B 8 valve
70KW @ 5600
133NM @ 4000 RPM

G16B 16 valve
73KW @ 6000
133NM @ 3000 RPM

G13B DOHC
74KW @ 6450
113NM @ 4950 RPM


all pretty much on par to me


1600gti - your new set up should work very well
have you thought about using a quad throttle setup off a busa these would be perfect for an n/a set up with that combo

back on topic

bails
there s not that much off the shelf ,for these but theres is lots of aftermarket parts that can be modified to fit such as pistons rods cams etc
its not out of the norm to fit 4age rods into a g13b
i would suggest having a chat to tjmgti or tekkie they have had some nice results going n/a

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Last edited by SUZ137 on Sat Oct 10, 2009 1:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:26 pm 
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Location: darwin
yer thanks for the help. was thinking bout getting some cams and maybe some new valve springs. kinda that sort of thing dont want or need to do anything to extreme just a little bit more power and tourqe.


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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:00 pm 
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SUZ137 wrote:
G16B SOHC
70KW @ 5600
133NM @ 4000 RPM

G16B DOHC
73KW @ 6000
133NM @ 3000 RPM

G13B DOHC
74KW @ 6450
113NM @ 4950 RPM


all pretty much on par to me




WOW a DOHC G16B???????????????????
I dont know everything but from what i know there is no DOHC g16b motor ever factory made.
There is a rare g16k DOHC which is only has 8 valves
Where did you get your source from SUZ137??
I cant really understand why anyone would say that there aint much difference between a SOHC and a DOHC cause it aint for friggin cosmetic reasons.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:13 pm 
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sorry mate, back to your question.
We tried modifying our original g16b with a bigger cam and bigger t/b was good for about a week then it felt same old same old. If you are mechanically minded and do some research. DOHC is the way to go. I am not trying to push you just seems like your going down the same track everyone is and eventually you end up spending more money to try to get more power and its quite hard to squeeze the power out of those SOHC heads. Only g16b SOHC ones that make good power have a turbo attatched.
If you are keen on staying with what you got try getting a aftermarket ecu and porting the head along with a cam to suit.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:47 pm 
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IMHO, the only advantage by going twin cam, is the freedom to set the inlet and outlet valves timing independently... that's where the power comes from. But the twin cam head is not perfect either... it need a lot of work to flow good on a 1.6 donk.

there is a reason corvettes went back to push-rods last time... it starts with $$.

Was there not an SOHC8 head for G series?

IMHO, it's the engine management that made the difference. Try comparing phase 1 G16B to phase 2 G16B in the vitara/escudo... internally alike, but phase 2 produced 7ps and 0.7kg-m more at the same rpm than phase 1. That'd be the last iteration of G16 by suzuki.

I've recently test driven a J24 vitara, with VVT... decent engine, drive by wire response too slow. with some alterations, that'd be a nice upgrade for J18 baleno... though it is very much dead in the lower rpm (which got me back into the sohc8 toyota donk -RZ1).

I'm convinced suzuki have spent too much money on their newer models trying to satisfy EPA and goons, rather than enthusiasts.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:55 pm 
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Anyways, Bails...

start with the ECU, t/b (if yours a phase 1, read my other thread on t/b), head works, and short block work. If you're looking for direct bolt-ons... then there aren't much really, other than extractor and in box filter (the later doesn't add any power). The lightweight flywheel DMWdave offered simply frees up a bit more power used to spin the heavy factory one.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:00 am 
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If I had my time over I would have bought another Baleno GTX or a Swift GTi and steered clear of the 1.6 Baleno due to the fact the 1.3 Twin Cam has such a huge aftermarket and can easily make a lot of power.

I too have toyed with the idea of fitting a twin cam head to my Baleno but till now have resisted.

The 1.6 has bigger valves and better port design but is let down by a lame camshaft profile.

The 1.6 has loads of torque down low and I actually like that characterstic.
eg. Pulling through roundabouts in 4th gear at 1000rpm and having useable albeit low boost at 1300-1500rpm is something I doubt the Swift GTi's can do.

The valvetrain / rockers etc. are not too good on the 1.6 and adjusting the clearances is a pain that you don't have with the Twin Cam head's hydraulic buckets.

I would also avoid a lightened flywheel if I had my time over... on a street car it is horrid.

An aftermarket ECU is the best mod you can make... if it is tuned well.


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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 3:18 pm 
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SUZ137 wrote:
G16B 8 valve
70KW @ 5600
133NM @ 4000 RPM

G16B 16 valve
73KW @ 6000
133NM @ 3000 RPM

G13B DOHC
74KW @ 6450
113NM @ 4950 RPM




Thats better SUZ137
If the g13b produces 74KW and the g13bb which is a 16 valve SOHC only produces 59KW proves thet having a DOHC makes a HELL of a difference. Then using the general theroy of gains to the g13's a g16 DOHC would produce approx 88 KW.

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:34 pm 
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you are comparing Apples and oranges
g13bb: has low compression, cam profile that is not for making power
g13b: high compression, cam profile to make power mid to high rpm (high rpm is key with making power N/A)

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 Post subject: Re: g16b 16v engine mods/whre to buy?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 5:56 pm 
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No i am pretty sure i was comparing sohc to dohc. The dohc has higher compression to suit two cams. In the end you can tune two cams better than one.

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