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 Post subject: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:25 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Brussels
As per title, how would you go about it, what parts would you pick, and why?

Oh and no turbos (I saw ya'll coming hehe) :-D

S.


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2017 4:25 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 12:00 am
Posts: 1526
Location: Londoninium
Doubt you can do it. If you can it wont last long. You'll need revs, reasonably large ones. Big cams and there goes the budget.
Headwork, aftermarket ecu and probably substantial fuel metering mods. The dyno alone will nearly burn your budget.
looking at the redline N/A dyno leaderboard and those with 100hp at the wheels have those parts and lots more.
Or turbo it with turbo chip and have some change from second hand parts for fuel.
GTP


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2017 7:59 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:42 pm
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Location: BRISBANE
100 shot of NOS

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with GSXR 1000 QUAD TB'S


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:30 am
Posts: 81
Location: Wellington
$1000 what? Euro? Aussie? American?
Not that it really matters as it's almost impossible. 100HP NOS shot would be the only way to do it for $1000 and then you would only get 1 go at it :D

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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:25 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Brussels
haha nah thanks don't feel like blowing up my motor with NOS :-P

Reason for asking is space is a constraint (it's a mini conversion). My super researched ball park finger estimate based on nothing but gut is insprired by adriantilin's moke on here (I really should ask him directly). According to his build dairy mods are 60mm throttle body, bored out inlet manifold plenum to 60 mm, AFM housing to 49mm, hi-flow fuel rail, grp A chipped ECU and dyno results are 94bhp atw, mk1 inlet manifold (on a mk2 engine).

Compared to the list of mods vs power output page on here I figured it wouldn't cost that much, but figured I would through a ballpark figure with no info out there at see what yall come up with

What kind of budget to reach that kind of figure would be more reasonable? We can also talk in sterling pounds or euros, I have no particular bias :)


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:30 am
Posts: 81
Location: Wellington
He would have to have aftermarket cams for sure. There are quite a few NA builds on here that get to 100hp. You might be able to get there on 1500Euro with some shopping around for parts.

Probably some good cams, breathing mods and a good ECU tuned well and you should hit 100HP.

IMO - you either build to a power figure, or you build to a budget. You choose which one you are limited by :D

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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:59 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:25 pm
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Location: Brussels
Well I'm not gonna sell my kidneys for some crazy materialistic fun! But I like an excellent value for money challenge :-D


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:47 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 12:00 am
Posts: 1526
Location: Londoninium
100.2 HP at all 4 wheels close enough to what your talking in power.
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Bill Falconer Built the engine many moons ago (UK engine builder)
76mm Aria Pistons.
Extensive port headwork.
11mm lift custom cams
adjustable pullies
solid lifters
NO distributor
Haltec ECU and $900 in tuning
GSXR 42mm throttle bodies and custom alloy long inlet trumpets
2.5 inch cat and 2.25 inch exhaust on Cultus manifold.
LS1 quad coils
Big injectors
Walbro 255l fuel pump
Custom fuel lines
Custom fuel rail
DMW clutch on lightened AWD flywheel
Total waste of money if you ask me!
Turbo next!

GTP





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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 5:52 am 
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Location: Camden
You can't. It's as simple as that. Anyone who claims to have made that much and has proof has had fudged dump figures.
See gtp's post as above, ive been there and done it too, around $5-6000 later, 102hp at the wheels.

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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:29 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2017 6:25 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Brussels
Ouch 5-6K! No wonder you sold it!

OK fair enough guys. I appreciate for the reality check!

It seems pretty clear the more power you want the more exponential the investment without going turbo.

What kind of power upgrades would you consider wise value for money (ie before that expoential curve sky rockets)? Intake + outtake? Chip mod (but I think this is kinda useless if it's not adjusting for anything else)?...


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:57 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 15, 2009 3:59 pm
Posts: 394
Location: Hamilton NZ
100hp@wheels g13b can be achieved with $1000 of parts, excluding labour.
Start with complete standard jdm cultus engine approx 85- 88hp@ wheels in good condition with
small frame box. Port head, de-shroud valves, increase compression ratio to 13 to 1, adjustable cam gears, 52 to 60mm tb matched to manifold, Standard Cast exhaust manifold, lengthen secondaries. Lighten standard flywheel, Standard injectors, breather catch bottle, preferable second hand programmable ecu. Run on av gas. Dial in to turn on at 3000rpm peak power at 7000rpm.

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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Wed Aug 30, 2017 6:00 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 12:00 am
Posts: 1526
Location: Londoninium
That's the problem though Blake. Much of what your proposing costs money. Starting with something most dont have a JDM hipo motor.
Mine was a good example of second-hand. Payed £600 in the uk for the engine sans ecu. Then I added a $500 second hand ecu $900 in tuning several hundred in fuel line mods and pumps. Add adjustable pullies and the extra cost of dialing them in on the dyne for best results then a clutch to handle the extra power and the $1000 goal becomes a dream quite quickly.
Good porting and other machining to get 13:1 means a rebuild too. Power is rarely about just parts. Knowledge costs money.
What I've learnt on the AWD road car is that turbo is such bang for you buck, its rude not too.
GTP


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:31 pm 
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Joined: Sat May 12, 2007 12:40 pm
Posts: 4019
Location: penriff
I fell a bee's dick short of 100hp at the wheels with the following setup.

Standard g13b, over 200k old.
210/340 3tech cams (with adjustable pulleys set to factory specs)
Cultus inlet manifold with 60mm sr20 throttle body
4-1 headers
2 inch mandrel bent exhaust with high flow cat

And the only expensive bit.
A Haltech ps1000 ecu wired up and tuned on BP98

For what it's worth the fuel system was completely standard.
As was the ignition system, even down the the factory spark plug leads.

Even with the VERY basic setup, I was well over your $1000 limit.



I should also mention this was with a large frame gearbox.

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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Thu Aug 31, 2017 7:13 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:40 am
Posts: 169
Location: NZ
Mine is .

Standard GTI.
Was tired.

Mike Cove..three tech...12.25:1 Honda Pistons machined.
Mike............................222/365 cam grinds
Mike.......16 stainless valves
Mike......underdrive pulley
New head bolts.
52mm TB with cultus manifold.
Max speeding rods....(not needed but factory balanced so going in)
Head job...light surface, valve grind, deshroud valve seats. No port work.
Standard pulleys for a start on standard settings.
2.25" exhaust (not mandrel bent)
Cast manifold....longer secondaries.
Lighter flywheel.
APV mls head gasket
Crank, flywheel, crank pulley and underdrive balanced. (Because engine is disassembled and harmonic balancer removed plus pistons are match and rods balanced already)
Gaskets, seals etc....maybe a new oil pump.
New lifters. Plugs, leads.

Looking to run initially on the F6 ECU with a chip and an AFR meter to check it's doesn't run lean. Maybe an ecu change later if that's no good.
I have no idea where I'll end up in terms of power but I can tell you....1k in the engine rebuilders, $2150 parts not including shipping....does not include exhaust or cultus manifold or plugs, leads , oil etc. then I put it together. Kiss 3k NZ goodbye to do a lot of the above minimum.

Just trying to make it real for you.

I hope I have a solid 100hp at the wheels. Judging by gtpswifts post above I don't have a s**t show. :shock:
Turbo no good....1.7 factor means racing 2 litre cars. Be fun though.


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 Post subject: Re: Query: G13B 100bhp atw for under $1000
PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2017 12:45 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 17, 2006 10:49 am
Posts: 533
Location: WA
Also bear in mind the conversion factors.
100 UK HP <> 100 AUS HP
More so for US dyno claims.

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